Need some help

[lls_mutant]

Okay, F-list, I realized I have a major question in AIL that I'm not sure I can answer. So I'm going to try to sort it out here, but I'd really, really like to hear thoughts.

The question: Why didn't James and Lily use Dumbledore as their Secret Keeper? Why did they insist on using Sirius-slash-Peter?

Now, the way I see it, Sirius would have had to have a REALLY strong reason for thinking Remus was the spy. Without giving too much away, I think it came down to when James and Lily were in hiding (because there is a difference between "in hiding" and "under Fidelus"), some secret was given away that only the six of them (James, Lily, Peter, Remus, Sirius, and Dumbledore) knew. I just can't see Sirius willingly suspecting any of his friends (much less his lover) of being a spy if he had ANY other alternative, and same with James. Now, James can eliminate that he and Lily are the spy, because they're being hunted. I can see why he trusted Sirius- they're best friends. But if you only have a certain number to pick from, why not use Dumbledore, when you KNOW Dumbledore is not the spy?

Or did James not know? Do you think something happened that caused James to think Dumbledore WAS selling them out?

I'm thinking it's one of those plot devices. It doesn't make sense for Dumbledore NOT to have offered, so JKR had to have him offer. But in order for the Sirius-Peter plot to work, Sirius had to be the secret keeper (or thought to be). So I suspect it's simply an emotional thing, where James was putting his trust in Sirius and yadayadayada. There might have been some arrogance there, too, of not wanting to listen to Dumbledore, because after all THEY were the guys who pulled off the Animagus transformation at 15, thanks. They knew what they were doing. I'm also under the impression that only the secret keeper could contact the family, and given that Sirius WAS James's best friend, and Harry's godfather and all that, they wanted to keep contact with at least one friend. Does this make sense?

I'm also thinking that the location of the Secret Keeper was not under Fidelius. Sirius was going to go "into hiding", but does that necessarily mean under Fidelius, or did he just make himself unplottable and meant to move? I suspect that there are lesser hiding spells that a wizard can use to keep himself concealed, and that's what Sirius was intending. (Before he decided to switch, of course.)

Other brilliant thoughts?

Comments

[lissannej.livejournal.com]

Actually, I've always thought they didn't choose Dumbledore because he was too obvious a choice; not that Sirius, Remus and Peter weren't obvious too, but Voldemort must have known about the Order, which was formed by Dumbly, and perhaps they didn't want to put Dumbly in such a position of risk because of him being Headmaster at Hogwarts -- as Headmaster, he also had a responsibility to a thousand students to keep them safe. That's my take, anyway! Good question, though. And you remind me I must catch up with AIL!

[lls-mutant.livejournal.com]

The responsibility thing I can dig. I'm noticing a trend that no one else seems to have a really concrete reason either, which a.) screams "plot hole!" and b.) tells me that it was an emotional thing for the boys. Thanks!

[momebie.livejournal.com]

The way I always sort of understood it in my head was that, even though Dumbledore was the best man, he would have been obvious. If Dumbledore drops out of sight from the opposing forces to go into hiding with the secret then the Death Eaters would know something is up. It had to have been an emotional thing too, and I imagine it was hard for him to use Peter instead of Sirius, but at the same time he would have understood that the opposing side would have known Sirius was his best mate and sniffed him out quickly. They did go to school with a fair few of the Death Eaters after all.

If you're going to make it so that only the secret keeper can contact the family then it would make sense for James to want to keep in contact with Sirius. It would then of course, take some mighty persuasion on Sirius' side to convince him to use Peter instead.

The thing that I've never understood, and attempted to explain in a fic I never finished, was that Sirius should have been in hiding, yet he meets with Peter for the showdown. I can understand that Peter was made secret keeper in lieu of Sirius and that he went right to Voldemort with that information. But if as you suggest, the only person who can contact the family is the secret keeper, how did Sirius know they had died? Someone had to have told him. Unless he was hiding in a place he could view the carnage, which seems unlikely to me. If someone told him then there has to be someone who knows flat out that he didn't betray his friends, why didn't they say anything when he went to Azkaban?

Also, some random questions about the Fidelius:
You only know something once the secret keeper has told you, right? If the secret keeper tells, does that make the spell null and void or is the information then privvy to just the two of you? How did Dumbledore know so quickly that something had happened as to be able to send Hagrid and again, how did Sirius know to be there?

I was thinking that there may be a charm of some sort to let someone know when a Fidelius has been broken. If so then it is possible the charm was triggered when Peter told and both Dumbledore and Sirius were notified. Voldemort would have acted on this information quickly to give them no chance for escape so even though Sirius headed there straight away he was still too late, as was Hagrid.

Alright, I'm sorry if that didn't make any sense. :)

[nassima.livejournal.com]

How did they all know the Potters had died? That's a question I hadn't considered before, but here's what I'd imagine. Fidelius protected people can't be found when you're looking for them, but that doesn't make them unplottable, does it? I guess that the Death Eater attack was a classical one, with burned house and Dark Mark floating over the scene, so that the authorities would have known rather quickly, as well as any wizards in the neighborhood. And from them, everyone else.

[krisomniac.livejournal.com]

If the secret keeper tells, does that make the spell null and void or is the information then privvy to just the two of you?

It's privvy to just the two of you. We know this because Dumbledore could reveal the "secret" whereabouts of the OOtP to members only, and non-members were unaware of the existance of the house.

How did Dumbledore know so quickly that something had happened as to be able to send Hagrid and again, how did Sirius know to be there?
This is the dicey one, and lord knows I've spent an ungodly number of hours considering it. Ultimately, it's a device. But one could argue that the death of the "secret" (i.e. Lily and James OR the House, whichever was hidden) somehow broke the spell. As for how Dumbledore knew something was up, I would suggest that the near death of Lord Voldemort was the catalyst, as that was not protected under a fidelius. Oh! and as for the Dark Mark. Do we know whether it was over their house? Because to mark them, Peter would have had to cast it. If Peter marked them for the world to see, that's one easy way to circumvent the spell. Anyone who saw the mark would have been "told".

[nimori.livejournal.com]

The thing that I've never understood, and attempted to explain in a fic I never finished, was that Sirius should have been in hiding, yet he meets with Peter for the showdown.

IIRC, in PoA Sirius says that he went to check on Peter, who was also supposed to be hiding, one last time before he hid himself. Peter wasn't there, and he got a bad feeling. He went to Godric's Hollow, found James and Lily dead and Hagrid taking Harry away, and gave Hagrid his motorcycle. Then he went looking for Peter.

[lls-mutant.livejournal.com]

was that Sirius should have been in hiding, yet he meets with Peter for the showdown.

I figure Sirius couldn't have hid TOO well, otherwise what's the point of a bluff, right?

How Sirius knows they died I can answer. Why Sirius suspected Remus I have about 100 answers for. It's just the Sirius/Dumbledore askpect. ::Sigh::

I was thinking that there may be a charm of some sort to let someone know when a Fidelius has been broken.

This one I can even come up with; even if it's just that there's some sort of spell that Sirius knows if James has died (which I'm blatantly setting up in AIL 9) or the appearance of the Dark Mark, like Kris says. Or just an explosion. That would wake people up.

It's also entirely possible that, once he was made Secret Keeper, Peter DID tell Sirius where the Potters were, since Sirius knew he could be trusted. I can make everything work, but I wasn't sure about the Dumbledore issue. ::Sigh::

Plot devices :)

[nassima.livejournal.com]

What you say about it looks the more likely. All motivations aren't logical, and I definitely can see why James and Lily would prefer having Sirius or Peter as their contact with the rest of the world rather than Dumbledore.

What else, then. Well, we can imagine that protecting the Potters wasn't considered as a number one priority at the time. After all, the Marauders et al. were very young at the time, and probably only a small part of the effort that was put into fighting Voldemort. And they certainly weren't the only ones who were threatened by Voldemort. I'm not sure that the Prophecy changed this a lot, especially since it was Trelawney first and at the time only reliable prophecy (so how could they know?)
So Dumbledore could have had other things to do than going into hiding or getting into more danger to protect three persons. My version: he offered to be the Secret Keeper, the Potters thought better of it, he didn't insist.

[lls-mutant.livejournal.com]

Thanks! The bit about not being 100% sure Trelawney's prophecy was reliable is very interesting. I'll have to dwell on that.

This scenario does make sense to me, but it's one of those obnoxious things where I'm not sure that we were ever supposed to question it, even though you would if you're a MWPP writer.

Thanks for the input!

[krisomniac.livejournal.com]

Hmmm. One possible reason James and Lily did *not* select Dumbledore is that, as the only wizard Voldemort feared, Dumbledore was the biggest target of them all. If Sirius was to go into hiding, that doubly protects the secret he carries. Dumbledore, as leader of the resistance cannot hide. We don't know expicitly what happens if the Secret Keeper is killed, but I think it's safe to assume that the spell is broken.

Though Dumbledore is a more powerful wizard than Sirius, his targeted status would make him a higher risk than Sirius -- who was planning to 'disappear' himself. Dumbledore knew that they planned to use Sirius, and must have aproved -- or at least seen the reasoning behind it.

It still doesn't explain why they didn't fill DD in on the switch. He is the leader of their order, the one who heard the prophesy, the one who wants the Potters hidden. It makes complete sense to tell him that there was a switch, if anything, so that he could make sure Peter was properly protected and Sirius had a *week* in which to do it. Still he didn't. *That* is the angle I would use if you want evidence of the Marauders' mistrust in Dumbledore (which I don't think there is. I think that one is just the bigger plot hole).

Yeah, it does make you wonder when characters start acting on tenuous logic to accomplish twists of plot...

[ignipes.livejournal.com]

Yeah, it does make you wonder when characters start acting on tenuous logic to accomplish twists of plot...

In the Harry Potter books? Never! Well, except for the ENTIRE PLOTS of Books 4 and 5. It's funny how many fandom theories and arguments grow out of what is just pure carelessness on JKR's part.

[lls-mutant.livejournal.com]

LOL. The only problem with Dumbledore being a bigger target is... well, he's already a HUGE target. And he's older. There was something I made Caradoc say in part 8 about it being an old man's war and the young men's fight, and being very bitter that DD was sending Remus, who was only 20, straight into danger.

I think if the Secret Keeper is killed, the spell is intact, but it also means that there's no way of ever getting in contact with Lily and James unless they end the spell themselves. Maybe. Perhaps.

One big question though:

It makes complete sense to tell him that there was a switch, if anything, so that he could make sure Peter was properly protected and Sirius had a *week* in which to do it.

Can you point me to the source on this? I've always maintained that there wasn't a lot of time between Sirius's decision Remus was the spy, the SK switch, and Peter's betrayal, but I know I could easily be wrong. Even if you can tell me which book, that would be great. (We have so little canon evidence around here, I'd rather not step on what we do have!)

[book-people.livejournal.com]

Hello! Avid AIL reader here!

Here's a theory...
So, a secret was given away. The only /logical/ explanation is that Remus told the death eaters, he being a spy for Dumbledore amongst the Death Eaters and all, and Remus answers directly to Dumbledore. So, James and Sirius assume that Dumbledore told Remus to tell, and Remus did. This means several things: for one, it drives home to James that Dumbledore is willing to sacrifice members of the Order to further the Order's cause. That means that if Dumbledore feels he needs to sacrifice the Potters and is their secret keeper, he will. They can't have Remus do it because he's a spy (for the Order) and thus habitually hangs out with Death Eaters. Thus, it is rather stupid to have him be Secret Keeper. James and Lily are having the spell cast on them, so they can't. That leaves Sirius and Peter.

The good thing about this theory? Sirius doesn't think that Remus would willingly tell the Death Eaters anything without direct orders from Dumbledore. He's just afraid Remus will /get/ those orders at some point. So, it's not really a matter of Sirius not trusting Remus, and the desperately-in-love-but-suspicious-of-the-other's-motives thing is avoided. The bad thing? It turns out the way it did.

*shrug* Just an idea. Feel free to ignore me.

Adi

[lls-mutant.livejournal.com]

What's really interesting about this idea- and fits- is the idea that Dumbledore is willing to sacrifice certain members to the cause. Sirius will actually suspect Remus; that's pretty canon to me. I'm not at all worried about how to get that part to work. But I've toyed with the concept of some people (particularly Caradoc) being a bit bitter at Dumbledore for the sacrifices and decisions that Dumbledore must make, and that would be interesting to play with. As of right now- and 9 times out of 10 by the end of the fic- James and Peter don't know that Remus is a spy for the Order. Peter might catch on, but Remus only told Sirius the once, and really hasn't said much about it since.

Thanks for the input!

[minnow-53.livejournal.com]

You said it. Plot device.

^_^

[lls-mutant.livejournal.com]

Heh. Yeah. Now the question... how can I make it work for me? :)

[kyasuriin.livejournal.com]

Perhaps James made Sirius secret keeper to 'prove' that he trusted him; that he thought he wasn't the spy. and also for the reasons listed above (harry's godfather, bestfriend, etc.) But for some reason I can see James and Sirius getting in an argument over who James thinks is the spy and James not wanting to come out and say he thinks its Remus and so Sirius thinking that James suspects him (and James making Sirius secretkeeper to calm his suspicions). But thats just how things are playing in my head right now, heh

[lls-mutant.livejournal.com]

This seems to be a pretty wide consensus- at least that it's an emotional thing. Which is good, because it's pretty much where I'm going. but yeah, I can see that scenario too.

Thanks!

[maglors-finch.livejournal.com]

IMO "Plot device" is the correct answer here, but that's not very satisfactory when you're writing fanfiction. So, why not Dumbledore? As I don't believe for a moment they suspected Dumbledore of double dealing, it must have something to do with the overconfidence that comes with inexperience. James and Sirius are still young enough to believe in all sincerity they'll do better than the previous generations. They want to prove they can handle this by themselves; no need for an 100+ old wizard to step in. It's not a rational choice, but why expect them to be rational? Actually, my main problem is Lily; I've always wondered why she didn't have a little more common sense.
Maybe she didn't know about James's decision?

As for the question why Sirius suspected Remus, my anser would be that he suspected him by default. Knowing that he wasn't the spy, Sirius had the choice between Dumbledore, Peter and Remus. Dumbledore was beyond suspicion. He considered Peter to be too insignificant. So it had to be Remus. Actually, your own story makes it more believable that it was Remus, what with Sirius's experience with the Imperius curse and his knowledge that Remus was involved with the DE's as a spy for the Order. The conclusion seems inevitable.

[lls-mutant.livejournal.com]

Yes. Lily is the other problem, but I can get around that really, really easily. Or I could before JKR's last update to her site. I think maybe Lily put some other protection on Harry, or that there was a charm there that was intentional, so she just did the smile and nod thing when James refused to use Dumbledore. JKR's latest update made it sound less intentional, but... :P~~~~.

Sirius suspecting Remus is pretty easy for me, for the exact reasons you pointed out. I can come up with a LOT of things that eventually point to Remus, and that part's not hard. It's the Dumbledore bit that's bugging me.

Plot device indeed! :)

[elsie.livejournal.com]

I think we can all agree that Dumbledore would have been a very obvious choice for Secret-Keeper, and too big a target to be saddled with this burden. That's why Sirius gave the position to Peter; he felt that as James's best friend, he was too obvious. Conversely, who would suspect inept little Peter?

A lot of people don't think this explanation cuts it because it's not as though Voldemort could get the information out of Dumbledore (or Sirius) simply by knowing he was the Secret-Keeper and catching him. The Secret-Keeper has to give the information; it cannot be forcibly extracted, and Dumbledore wouldn't have given the information even under torture. But it's always safer not to know anything if you are in danger of being tortured for information. Even if you would rather die than talk, you don't want to even give yourself the chance to spill secrets. I think this is why Sirius and Dumbledore both thought they were unsuitable candidates. They knew they were the most likely people to be caught and tortured for the Potters' whereabouts, and they wanted to be 100% sure that they couldn't tell, no matter what was done to them.

Unfortunately, Sirius and the Potters' fucked it up, because they forgot that they had never kept Peter quite as close as they had kept each other. Peter was always the "lowest-ranked" Marauder, and it didn't do anything to strengthen his loyalty to his friends.

[lls-mutant.livejournal.com]

This makes sense to an extent. The only thing is Sirius's arrogance... I think that he fully 100% believed you'd never get anything out of him. But I also don't think there was just one reason. ::Sigh:: Silly plot device!

[pinkfinity.livejournal.com]

In canon, I'd say what if the longbottoms asked him because they had nobody else to ask, and perhaps they didn't think it a good idea to have him as secret-keeper for both families, but I'm not sure that works in your verse, as Alice would likely have chosen Sirius, too.

[lls-mutant.livejournal.com]

Heh. Actually, DD IS the Secret Keeper for the Longbottoms in my universe, because there were two people putting a lot of pressure on Alice not to use Sirius: Frank (who's never been the world's biggest Sirius fan anyway) and Gran, who either wanted to do it herself or wanted DD.

Personally, if I was Voldemort, I'd rather take my chances with Dumbledore!!!!

Takes a deep breath. (Part 1)

[midnitemaraud-r.livejournal.com]

You see, this is the area that always, always bothers me with her overall plot.

First of all, it's not like anyone would be announcing who the secret keeper was, so I can't see that it would have been a burden on Dumbledore. As the de facto leader of the Order, he was already laden with enough secrets - one more was not going to break him. And if the death eaters (and Voldemort) were never able to get to him before, why would that change? Dumbledore has proven that he is well matched to Voldemort, but any of the other death eaters would have quite a time outwitting/overpowering Dumbledore. And in this case, you can't even compare it to a possible David and Goliath kind of scenario, because, (personally) what we've seen of most of the DE's, Dumbledore is just too good for them. Voldemort's best option was to get himself a spy in Dumbledore's camp. He couldn't outright defeat him, so what better way to sabotage him?

The problem I have with scenarios where Sirius knows Remus is spying on the DE's for Dumbledore is that if Remus had Dumbledore's trust to do that, and Sirius KNEW, the dynamics would have been different. Obviously you don't choose Remus as secret keeper because of the precarious position he'd have to place himself in, nor would it be wise to tell him who the secret keeper is, but... I mean it would all be too easy. There's a spy telling Order secrets. Dumbledore KNOWS Remus is spying for HIM - he's not a stupid man. Eccentric, yes, stupid, no. If he suspected Remus of being a double agent, I can't see him keeping the information to himself nor continuing to trust Remus.

So go with me here as I muddle though this:

Now, if Sirius didn't know the capacity in which Remus was 'working' for Dumbledore... then it makes more sense that he'd suspect Remus. And if he knows that Remus is working for Dumbledore, yet he thinks Remus is also the spy but Dumbledore doesn't think so... youthful arrogance and thinking that perhaps in this case he knows better than Dumbledore might lead him to think that the fidelius secret would be safer with him. After all, the spy (whether it's Remus or not) is obviously someone in close contact with Dumbledore, and he might think Dumbledore is too trusting, whereas he, Sirius, knows he himself is not the spy. So he thinks he's the better choice.

While Sirius would trust Dumbledore to keep the fidelius secret, perhaps he doesn't trust Dumbledore to keep the secret of who the secret keeper is to himself. After all, with the imperius curse in play, who knows who is being compelled to talk. So once Dumbledore knows that Sirius is going to be secret keeper, Dumbledore might let that bit of information slip to another 'trusted' associate - like Moody, or McGonagall, who are both susceptible to the imperius. I mean, anyone can come up behind your back and do it, and they both hold rather 'public' jobs outside the Order.

Realizing that it will eventually be known that he, Sirius, is the secret keeper, he comes up with a way to hide the knowledge of who the real secret keeper will be. By switching secretly to Peter, nobody except he, James, Lily and Peter will know. Not even Dumbledore. By containing this between the four of them, the Potters' safety is (to his thinking) practically assured:

Remus, whom he suspects because he's not privy to the knowledge that Remus is spying on Dumbledore's orders, doesn't know. Dumbledore doesn't know, so nobody else in the Order (including Remus) can know, and therefore none of the death eaters will ever know. It's like a plan within a plan within a plan.

After the Potters are killed, Dumbledore gives evidence (that's not used at trial because Sirius doesn't have one) that Sirius was the secret keeper. He never gives evidence (that we know of) that he suspected Sirius was the spy though. So that much works.

Takes a deep breath. (Part 2)

[midnitemaraud-r.livejournal.com]

However, the thing that foils this all up is that Dumbledore never once goes to talk to Sirius before (or even while) he's imprisoned and just accepts that Sirius was the spy even though he had no other evidence before the Potters' deaths, and THAT is what doesn't work for me. Dumbledore has never struck me as a man who takes things on faith like that. And with his position on the Wizengamot, the fact that Sirius wasn't afforded a trial... The fact that he didn't even try to speak to Sirius, and despite Crouch's power, Dumbledore wielded plenty of his own where he could have gotten in to at least TALK to Sirius - either before or after he was sent to Azkaban.

On the other hand, perhaps Dumbledore did have misgivings about Sirius. Voldemort was not a stupid man either. He'd have to at least consider the fact that Dumbledore would try to infiltrate his 'organization'. Whether he knew it was Remus is actually immaterial. Peter's being the traitor could have been kept secret amongst his 'most faithful' - i.e. for argument's sake, let's say Lucius and Bellatrix. How easy would it have been to make veiled remarks about a spy in Dumbledore's camp, and for Bellatrix especially, how much pleasure would she have taken in alluding that it was Sirius?

So Remus, hearing this 'gossip', tells Dumbledore and... wheels within wheels within wheels.

So that's one possible way to look at the whole thing in a sort of logical way. Although the whole Dumbledore accepting that Sirius was imprisoned without a trial still grates! :)

[wickedevra.livejournal.com]

Most of this has been said already, but just because I feel the need to add my two cents...

I wonder if DD being a target could have been a factor. Flitwick feels the need to point out that Fidelius involves "the magical concealment of a secret inside a single, LIVING soul" (emphasis added) Obviously if the Secret Keeper him/herself has any active role to play in performing the charm, it helps if they're alive. If not, it makes far more sense to have a dead secret keeper cause you know they can't tell! But does this imply that the charm is voided if the keeper dies?

I don't see James ever mistrusting DD, but it would be an interesting parallel to Harry's realisation of DD's fallibility if James had had reservations about his strategy or something.

There's not an exact time frame for the switch, but Sirius does say that he persuaded James and Lily to change "at the last moment" which implies there wasn't much time left for admin.

[lls-mutant.livejournal.com]

Yeah, the age thing is a thought. No one knew that Voldie's reign was going to end as abruptly as it did. I mean, they'd been fighting him in one way or another for 11 years.

My real guess is that there's no deep reason- it just worked best this way, but.... ::Sigh:: When you have the advantage of 20/20 hindsight and so do your readers....

[cheshyre]

Hadn't even thought of that question.
My gut response (without reading all the other answers) is that Dumbledore is incredibly busy. It was October, school just started... Maybe this comes from reading fernwithy's "Shifts" but if there were selected people the Potters did want to have access, a busy Dumbledore might not be able to grant them. [A minor plot point in "Shifts" involves a desire for Andromeda Tonks to gain access to 12 Grimmauld Place, but Dumbledore is too busy and/or under surveillance to get the information to her.]

[lls-mutant.livejournal.com]

That's an interesting thought.

The only problem with that theory is that Dumbledore offered to be the Secret Keeper. If DD hadn't offered, I'd have no problem whatsoever with why wasn't DD the Secret Keeper.

Ah well. Thanks though!

Here from Snitch :)

[scarah2.livejournal.com]

I think there is a reason why Dumbledore was left out of the loop: he can't be trusted not to give anything away to Remus.

Who is loyal to Remus in canon?

Sirius, because he labored to become an animagus so he could go marauding with Remus? I could have thought so until OotP, but from his "Wish it were full moon" comment, I think Sirius did these things because he enjoyed them.

Or Dumbledore, who went out of his way to plant the Willow so that Remus could come to school, and later gave Remus a job? He did both of these things at risks to his career, and possibly the lives of his students and staff. And for no other apparent reason other than that he likes Remus and/or fancies himself an activist.

Remus had friends, but his greatest supporter has always been Dumbledore. I'm not surprised they wouldn't go straight to Dumbledore the minute they suspected Remus.

Re: Here from Snitch :)

[lls-mutant.livejournal.com]

Oooooooooooooooh, now THIS is interesting and something I've never thought of! I LIKE this thought. It doesn't completely work to explain why DD wasn't used, but the idea that he would have told Remus and that he has faith in Remus is REALLY intesting. Must brood....

Thanks!

the hubris of youth

[jazzypom.livejournal.com]

Basically. All the four were young, strong, and thought that their bonds of friendship were unbreakable, the one constant in the changing world, and for them to just suddenly made Dumbeldore the secret keeper would have been odd, really.

Re: the hubris of youth

[lls-mutant.livejournal.com]

Yeah, this is kind of what I'm thinking, actually. The more I think about it, the more I think there wasn't a deep reason- just Dumbledore needed to offer so he could give evidence at the lack-of-trial. Thanks!

[argyle-s.livejournal.com]

The way the Fidelius charm works is simple. You cast it, and the secret becomes impossible for anyone other than the secret keeper to communicate to anyone else. It can not, however, erase anyone's memories. Since Dumbledore already knew where James and Lily were hiding, he didn't have to me told. Same with Sirius. Now, Voldemort might well have known where they lived, but he didn't know they'd gone into hiding in their own home. In theory, the entire group of Death Eaters could have moved into James and Lily's house and stayed there for a money and the charm would have prevented them from figuring out James and Lily and Harry were in the house.

The secret keeper can tell anyone he wants and it doesn't break the charm, because the people he tells can't pass on the information. This is how Dumbledore's note could reveal the location of the Order Headquarters to Harry. Also, if only the secret keeper knew the secret, headquarters would be useless because none of the rest of the Order would know it existed.

[lls-mutant.livejournal.com]

That's a thought, that if you already know, that the Fidelus charm doesn't remove the knowledge from your memory. Hmmmm.

The rest I'm on the same line as you are. Thanks!

[yma2.livejournal.com]

Wow! It's Yma off FA! Didn't know you had an LJ. Dude, you are SO friended!
But on a more serious note...
For me the answer is very simple. At this time there were only two things that Voldemort was afraid of. Two things which seemed to have a chance of destroying him. The boy from the prophesy and Dumbledore. I find it perfectly possible to belive that if the secret keeper dies then the spell fails. So if Dumbledore died, or was captures and tortured, it's possible that the Wizarding World wouldn't just loose both it's Last Hopes in one go! It's a bit of a simplistic answer, granted, but it's possible. Besdies, it might be a matter of James feeling sorry for Dumbledore. The poor man has a lot on his shouldrs already without adding more to it. That's my only expleanations, anyway.
Hope you don't mind me friending you. I'll check out more of your entires later. Bye!

[lls-mutant.livejournal.com]

Hey- don't mind at all! :) Besides, this way you get AIL updates a lot earlier, because they don't make it onto FA until at least a week later ;)

And ::snerk:: at your icon. That's classic!

The double Last Hope thing is interesting, and I like that. I'll have to think about it in more detail.

Thanks!