Breathing Again

[lls_mutant]

::breathes deeply.::

Remus/Sirius specifically, and things related to marauders

Oh thank GOD, Remus/Sirius did not come up.

However, I do suspect it's not meant to be canon. When asked about the godmother (again!), JKR mentions that Sirius never had time to get a girlfriend, let alone marry. To me, that sounds like she thinks he's straight. But it's not a from-the-horse's-mouth sinking, so meh.

Before I got too into R/S, I had the impression that JKR really never thought much about them as a couple- or at all- and the subtext was accidental. I mean, really, most everything does have a platonic meaning to it. Actually, I think every bit of text has an alternate platonic meaning to it. However, I do think that it's canonically plausible with what we know right now, and that's good enough for me to be going on with, at least to finish Accidentally In Love. However, I think the ship as a whole would be very, very wise to stop shouting we're canon or should be canon. It's an interesting dynamic, and that's enough.

The reason she can't say much more about the godmother situation, however, I suspect plays into the war. I DON'T think they were suspecting Remus heavily already. Note that in her original answer to this question, she points out that it was JUST Sirius, James, Lily, Harry, and the priest. No Peter. No Dumbledore. So why not no Lupin? My guess is that Peter, Dumbledore, and Lupin agreed to stay away in order not to attract any more attention. Because even though they were in hiding, I don't think the Fidelus charm was on them yet- it sounds like Peter broke that pretty quick.

I AM very appreciative of this sentence:

Right, well, that's what I believed. Sirius would have done it. He, with all his faults and flaws, he has this profound sense of honor, ultimately, and he would rather have died honorably, as he would see it, than live with the dishonor and shame of knowing that he sent those three people to their deaths, those three people that he loved beyond any others, because like Harry he is a displaced person without family.

I assume that "those three people" in the context of the interview means James, Remus, and Peter, not James, Lily, and Harry (although that fits as well). While I firmly believe James and Sirius were "bestest friends", I don't think Remus and Peter were unimportant to him. I think that Remus and Peter were the most important people in the world, and then James was the most important person in the universe, if that makes any sense. It also makes me think it must have broken Sirius's heart to suspect Remus, and did break his heart fully when Peter betrayed them and it led to James's death. God, of all the things I love about Sirius, his devotion to these three is at the top of the list. And that's actually why I think he never really made a commitment to Remus in Accidentally in Love (there's a huge difference between loving someone and a commitment)- he couldn't fully distill what he was feeling. His platonic feelings for Remus were so strong already, that the romantic feelings sort of got lost.

Anyway.

Very little we didn't know about the marauders, although I was delighted to see Lily/Lupin confirmed as a non-romantic thing (at least requited). The reason I was delighted had everything to do with Kloves and nothing at all to do with the shippers, because I've never really heard much of a peep from the shippers and they seem quite normal. But I always thought Remus would never do that to James. Nice to know she was kind of popular, though, and I think the Snape being in love with Lily theory picked up some steam. I was hoping for something a little more complicated, but HBP shot down those expectations. (Which is not bashing HBP. I think what HBP did was pull me back into perspective.)

And Snape was loved? IS that by Lily? Or the mysterious Florence? Or his parents? We have the impression Snape's miserable at home, but really- his father was shouting at his mother. As a lot of children of divorce can tell you, that doesn't mean they didn't love him.

Some random thoughts:

Ron's Patronus being a Jack Russell is too cute. I saw a really nice theory on Patroni on HPfGU that the form of your Patronus is determined in some way by your happiest memory. It's a sweet theory, and I quite like it.

Hmmm. A couple points I've written being proved wrong. The Veil was never used for executions, just study. Oh well. I still think Mentors is one of the best pieces of fanfic I've written, so who cares? And James's and Lily's parents died normal deaths. Y'know, I really considered doing that. I really did. But it was too many normal deaths in too short a space- that's why I wiped them out in what amounted to a terrorist attack. I'm not saying it doesn't work: in JKR's stuff, where the focus is on the present, you can kind of ignore four deaths in a matter of years. In Accidentally in Love, where it's the backstory you're being told, that seems kind of weird- especially when so many people are dying from Death Eater attacks. But one thing I think JKR and I both agreed on: you can't put TOO much angst into those deaths- it just gets overdone and overloaded then. (Especially since they aren't Lupin, King of Angst.)

Can I just say I am SO glad there's nothing else going on with the gum wrappers? The scene with Neville and his parents is SO touching... I just wanted it left entirely alone. No hidden meaning... just a very difficult love. And it is.

I really loved her point about how, in OotP, Cho sees Harry sitting with Luna and Neville and he's embarrassed, and when he's seen with them in HBP, he's proud. I noticed that in the book (and the sad lack of both characters ::sniff::), and it made me very proud of Harry. I also thought it was a very realistic and touching way to show how much Harry has grown up.

I'm glad she cleared up how George and Fred got the bet right at the Quidditch Cup, and I'm happy about her answer, as well. Those two are a riot.

Someone somewhere wondered if we've seen a horcrux in every book so far. Oooh- interesting. Let's see. We do know we saw the diary in book 2, the locket in 5, and Hufflepuff's cup in 6. What could we have seen in 1, 3, and 4? It's definitely a thought.

Aberforth/Goats has more support! Whoohoo! (Joking. Sort of. I do think that's really funny.)



Thoughts on the ship conversations in the interview, and the fallout.

Ships, ships, ships. Is anyone else getting rather sick of the word?

Okay. So, my OTP is Remus/Sirius, and my lesser ships (or favored ships, because I do nothing about them) were Harry/Ginny and Ron/Hermione, Charlie/Tonks, Bill/Fleur, the canon ships, and that's pretty much it. So I realize I have VERY little to complain about in HBP. Sure, Remus/Tonks came up, but that doesn't discount Remus/Sirius (as we've been over 1,324,962 times), and while I LOVE Charlie/Tonks as a fan ship, I never really held out that much hope for it as a canon ship. (Because, y'know, it would require them actually meeting.) But I got Harry/Ginny, Ron/Hermione, and Bill/Fleur, plus some cuteness on Molly/Arthur.

But I will be SOOOOO glad when the shipping frenzy dies down.

Re: Part 2 of the interview, and the repeated use of the word "delusional." First, I've gotta say that was tactless. But tactless, as Ron frequently shows, is not a sin punishable by death. I have issues with Mugglenet at times anyway because of their anti-slash slant, but y'know, the kid running it is EIGHTEEN. And although he kept calling Harry/Hermione shippers delusional, Jo didn't use that word.

Then some of the Harry/Hermione shippers decided to prove him right. Egads.

Being on a ship that I am now saying has no chance of being canon, but at least makes sense, I can sympathize with Harry/Hermione shippers (the rational ones, which I realize is a far bigger base than the psychos), even though I've never shipped the pair. Sometimes we as the reader see and are more interested in a different dynamic than what the author intends for us to be interested in. Heck, that's why fanfiction exists! The trouble with ships like Harry/Hermione, Remus/Sirius, and McGonagall/Dumbledore is that they make sense. They make a lot of sense, and you can see where, but for authorial intent, these people might truly love each other. Some form of love is there in the text, in black and white, for everyone to see. Hermione and Harry DO love each other, as do Remus and Sirius and McGonagall and Dumbledore. And a lot of these shippers believe that love springs from a base of friendship. I've always believed that friendship is an important and necessary component of love, and these are three very strong friendships. Where do you really draw the line between the kind of love they have, and a romantic love? Sometimes it can be very, very hard. So I can see where the Harry/Hermione shippers come from, even if I don't agree.

And I have to admit I was holding my breath as I read a lot of part three, waiting for one of the interviewers to go on about how delusional or whatever we Remus/Sirius shippers are.

But to those ranting and raving and frothing at the mouth, chill. Please. Of course, most of you are not on my f-list, but I need to say it for my own sanity. CHILL. There's a huge difference between wishing your ship had happened and going psycho.

It's FINE to not like a ship. JKR is not perfect, and we don't have to say she is! But please do not start letter-writing campaigns saying that one ship or another should have happened. JKR is not out to destroy fans' lives or slight Hermione or degay Remus. I don't think she's the most brilliant romance writer ever (<-- glaring understatement), but I do think she's had these ships planned. I don't appreciate the emphasis on romantic love at the end of this book (the kids don't bug me, but the adults pairing off did to an extent), but it's not that offensive- just annoying, cloying, and trite. If you're really unhappy with how the ships turned out, think about what you like about YOUR ship, and use it in original fiction. Make YOUR story come out the way you want it to. And with that in mind:

I solemnly swear that when two guys appear to be in love in my fantasy series, that will actually be the case. And it will so be intended.

Anyway, while I think this Emerson person was truly tactless, it's time to move on with life.



Thoughts about Remus and his love life.

Okay. Just this last bit before I finally crash for the night.

I do accept Tonks/Remus as canon, if you couldn't tell. I've been thinking about it a lot, here and there. And I've put my finger on exactly what bugs me.

It's partly Tonks going all lovelorn, yes. But as krislaughs and others have pointed out, Tonks is very young. And she also has her place in the ranks of the blunt and tactless. But you know what makes me so uncomfortable about that hospital scene? I've behaved like that.

Yes, I can remember (although I don't care to) breaking down and crying because a crush or an ex wasn't interested. I was a little younger than Tonks, but even when I was Tonks's age... I can remember some nasty fights with my husband around the 1-year-into-the-relationship mark, although they weren't as bad. I look at myself now, and I look at myself then, and I don't really recognize myself. I've grown up. A lot. So part of Tonks's behavior is a squirm factor: partly because it's pathetic and partly because I've done similar. But the big problem?

It never worked.

Pity is not a basis for a relationship, and that's about what that reaction generates, usually. Pity and annoyance. At least, that's been my experience. It doesn't convince the guy you're right. That's NEVER happened to me. Now, granted, I don't exactly have a huge base to select from, but still.

So yeah. Anyway, I got thinking even more about how Tonks doesn't really understand Remus, because she wouldn't bring it up and yadayadayada and then I thought... Liss, you ship Remus and Sirius, of all people. Why do you think this is relevant?

Ouch. Good point.

Cause let's face it- which is worse, in the long run? Crying and begging right after Dumbledore dies and in front of people, or siccing you on an enemy as a prank and later suspecting you of being a spy? It's not like Remus has the best track record (in my head) of chosing people that are good for him, does he? Now, granted, the issues with Sirius are far more complicated, or can be, if you chose to make them so. But still.

Anyway, I'm tired, so I'll finish this off and say good night. And I think (I hope) this is the last you're going to hear from me on the subject of Remus and Tonks (because I'm really sick of the subject). Considering I don't write much post-Azkaban fic, much less post-OotP, I don't really expect it to be a big deal.

Comments

[thistlerose.livejournal.com]

I didn't realize you also shipped R/Hr and H/G. Cool!

I loved that passage about Sirius's sense of honor. YES. THANK YOU, JO. He had his share of flaws, but ultimately, he was a GOOD person. I think that the three people who mattered most to him WERE the Potters, and not MWP, since the Potters are the ones who would have died if he'd betrayed them to Voldemort (if he'd been their Secret Keeper). I'm going to split hairs and say that AT THAT POINT, those three mattered the most to him. At that point, he was convinced that Remus was the traitor.

[lls-mutant.livejournal.com]

Yeah- I ship both of em. I never actually read or write much of it, because I rarely do anything with the kids, but those are my pairings of choice.

I think that the three people who mattered most to him WERE the Potters, and not MWP, since the Potters are the ones who would have died if he'd betrayed them to Voldemort (if he'd been their Secret Keeper).

I think both are true, but I think she might have been referring to MWP in that quote. She was talking about Sirius shouting at Peter that "we would have died for you!", and would Sirius have stood by that? I think he would have died for any of the three of them- it was just James where it might have been put to the test. If Remus or Peter had been hunted, I think Sirius would have been willing to take that risk, too.

But yeah, he definitely would have died for the Potters. But I'll take my confirmation that Remus and Peter were extremely important to him when I can get it ;)

[wickedevra.livejournal.com]

Yay for the ship being as intact as it was before! That's nothing different to what she already said on her site, and it's interesting as it expresses the assumption many observers might have made without realising that Sirius and Remus were more than friends. And finally some positive and significant comments on Sirius as a character. I was getting the impression she might think we sort of idolise and hero worship him as like the all-time perfect man or something. Well, undoubtedly some fangirls do, but I think many love him for his edgy craziness and his humanity - it's not necessary to reiterate his flaws all the time. Give the dude a break, he's dead.

What she said about the gum wrappers was so poignant and sad.

I hadn't made the connection between the two Harry-Luna-Neville train scenes til now. That is very cool. Yay Harry!

I was surprised that neither Lily nor James's parents died in the war, but they did rather have enough

Mugglenet posted a retraction of sorts on that comment. It did annoy me in that I think the two people who were chosen to interview her should have appreciated they they represented an entire (graciously) envious fandom, and shown more respect for other people's ideas.

[nassima.livejournal.com]

Some reactions to your reactions!

The Sirius had not time to get a girlfriend/wife (or alternatively, was too busy being rebellious to get one) has been out on JKR site since a long time. R/S shippers have already debated about this one, and (of course) the general consensus was that it didn't sink the ship, on the opposite.

I never was sure that Rowling wrote Remus and Sirius as a couple since the beginning, but I do think that she heard about the pairing and is not adverse to it (but I in fact, I have no problems being accused of being delusional, so...). Rowling won't ever say Remus and Sirius were fucking like mad behind the doors in Grimmauld place, but I'd say that she seems careful not to say anything that makes it plain impossible! Yeah, Sirius was rebellious, but he never had girlfriends... at 22. Seems to me that he was very, very gay, then. Especially since everyone, including Snape, seems to have been at least slightly attracted to Lily, but not Sirius ;)

And Remus didn't love Lily romantically, only liked her very much because she was popular and friendly and all -he's the one who craves to be liked... Isn't that something that still leaves Remus for Sirius? This one was out in the PoA film (Remus being fond of Lily), too, so Rowling didn't say anything against it, and the R/S fans seemed to be okay with it. And she didn't say anything either against the very, very obvious Remus/Sirius subtext in that film.


Yeah, I've been thinking that one of the major reasons why I don't see Remus and Tonks working is because I do ship Sirius/Remus too, and think Remus beeing still in mourning at the end of HBP. But this does find justifications in the text, dammit. You're right, begging and asking for pity never worked (though in my case... it worked, but only for a little while, though there was real love between us - and then there were more harsh feelings and resentment and dependence than love, and we split). And really, Remus doesn't like that eager about loving Tonks (or even looking for her in the earlier parts of the book).

Then, was Sirius a better choice? I've always thought that thinking the other was the spy was a symmetrical thing. That's how I read the lines in PoA, when they both say they thought the other was the spy. I imagined that they had it narrowed down to someone among the Marauders, so that it was either Peter or the other. And in such situations, that doesn't mean that they automatically thought that the other was Evil and stopped loving him. I've always seen as close to the Resistance situation during World War II, where there were a lot of understandable reasons to change sides (not everyone is able to sacrifice loved ones to a cause, for example).

And anyway, I can't see the same deep friendship and understanding between Remus and Tonks that I saw between him and Sirius.

So yeah. I'm more of a post-Azkaban R/S shipper, but I don't feel that despaired by the new canon and the interviews. There are so many reasons that Remus' relationship with Tonks won't last! She's a woman, and after a few months of efforts and genuine tries, he's going to realise that he's fantasising about men more and more. And then that Tonks has annoying qualities with which he doesn't feel comfortable, and lacks the flaws he loved in Sirius... And he's going to feel out of place walking with her in the street, him so shabby and her so young and pink. And he'll miss black hair. And he'll wonder why he's feeling so awkward holding hands with a young pink-haired witch, when he never felt so holding hands with a man.

And then Sirius is going to come back, and what could Tonks do? Except leaving Remus for Charlie, of course.

[nassima.livejournal.com]

Also, forgot to say. I think that all this talk about Snape loving someone is Snape loving Dumbledore like a son. I thought that their relationship in HBP was increasingly sounding like this, and don't you think this fits whith what JKR says about making it Snape still more guilty?

[lissannej.livejournal.com]

The trouble with ships like Harry/Hermione, Remus/Sirius, and McGonagall/Dumbledore is that they make sense. They make a lot of sense, and you can see where, but for authorial intent, these people might truly love each other. Some form of love is there in the text, in black and white, for everyone to see. Hermione and Harry DO love each other, as do Remus and Sirius and McGonagall and Dumbledore. And a lot of these shippers believe that love springs from a base of friendship. I've always believed that friendship is an important and necessary component of love, and these are three very strong friendships. Where do you really draw the line between the kind of love they have, and a romantic love? Sometimes it can be very, very hard. So I can see where the Harry/Hermione shippers come from, even if I don't agree.

Thank you SO much for saying this, Liss. I wholeheartedly agree with you -- friends can and do love each other, and strong friendships like that between Harry and Hermione can lead to more. Even though it won't in canon, it doesn't mean the potential isn't there. Hence why I ship H/H post-Hogwarts *g*

And congrats on the baby boy!

[lls-mutant.livejournal.com]

I was getting the impression she might think we sort of idolise and hero worship him as like the all-time perfect man or something.

I'm getting that impression too, which is why I'm glad she finally focused on the positive side of Sirius's character. In fact, the reason I love Sirius is a character is he IS so flawed.

Of course, for every one of us that appreciates him as a character, you can find how many girls squealing over how hawt he is, so... ::rolls eyes::

Mugglenet posted a retraction of sorts on that comment.

I saw that retraction, too. I agree that they should have been more gracious about it- it's not like Harry/Hermione shippers are shipping something like Harry/Lucius, where let's just talk about ALL the things wrong with that. I don't ship H/Hr and I'm glad that JKR's made such a strong platonic friendship between them, but it's not remotely a theory worthy of derision! However, I thought she herself handled it pretty tactfully, saying that's not the word she'd chose, but still emphasizing it's not in her plans.

[lls-mutant.livejournal.com]

Oooooooh. I was going for paternal love, but I LIKE your interpretation!!!!! That's good. That's really, really, really good. Ooh yeah.

Re: Sirius and girlfriends.

It really surprises me (and slightly annoys me, heh) that they even asked that, because it HAS been on her site- the godmother thing, anyway. But it is surprising she seems to have no girlfriends in mind for Sirius. Now the good, not-wanting-to-be-disappointed part of my brain is saying she never put as much thought into Sirius, so no girlfriends is easy. And how was he supposed to meet them during the war? But the slashy part of my brain that still agrees about that deep, loving relationship between Remus and Sirius is nodding enthusiastically with your comments :) And I keep forgetting that Cuaron was VERY vocal about how he read Remus. That's not the online fandom- that's someone who works with her directly and has been told not to put certain things in the film.

My impressions of Remus and Lily are that Lily was one of the only girls that was truly kind to him. I think he was a little in awe of her, and perhaps he did have a bit of a crush on her (especially since she seems to be perfect ::wry grin::) because she was safe. He'd never compete against James, and besides, he may have thought Lily would never look at him. But yeah, all that does is lend credence to the idea that Remus is bisexual (which this round of canon certainly supports), and says he really cared about her. I don't know about you, but a lot of times when I had a new guy friend, I'd kind of have a crush on him for a while. The feeling would eventually fade, but it happened pretty often.

And really, Remus doesn't like that eager about loving Tonks (or even looking for her in the earlier parts of the book).

And that, more than anything, is what bugs me. I can buy that Tonks feels the way she does, although the throwback to the 1950s annoys the hell out of me. But we have NO evidence from Remus. We really don't. The only thing you could take as it is his depression at Christmas, and he has enough reasons to be depressed.

Re: the spy. I waffle back and forth on Remus suspecting Sirius, but either interpretation doesn't bug me. I can't figure out if he's apologizing just for the time Sirius is in Azkaban, or for before. Either works. Some days I really like the theory that Remus DID suspect Peter, and then events played out as they did and Remus felt really, really guilty for his suspicions. But I agree that just because they thought the other might have switched sides doesn't mean they could shut off their emotions immediately. I really think it must have broken Sirius's heart to have to suspect one of them.

I don't think Tonks and Remus should last, myself. But if we see as little of them as we have to this point... heh. And I did think her transition was really interesting. In Part 2 of the interview, she talked about how you could be really attracted to something and then realize it was too much to handle. She said that and then said "what did you think of Lupin/Tonks?" I'm sure I'm reading too much into it, but I could so easily make a connection there!

And yeah, Tonks should be with Charlie. Much better match! :)

[lls-mutant.livejournal.com]

You're welcome :) I couldn't agree more with the friends thing- hubby and I were friends for a whole year before we got together, and most of my friends married their good friends as well. It's not like the hate/love ships, or the cross-gen ships. And like I said in my post, most H/Hr shippers are not insane ;) Every ship has their few bad apples!

I sometimes think what causes ship wars is the one side's refusal to admit the other side might have a point. I've seen a lot of people saying that most H/Hr fans never expected it to become canon, but this is why they love Harry/Hermione. And I think the arguments start when people say "but Harry and Hermione will never get together because it's going to be Hermione and Ron!" rather than "Hhmm. Interesting point, and I can see why you like that. Don't agree- I like Ron/Hermione better- but yeah. It's not impossible." I know that's when I get really annoyed at people who are anti-R/S. Not when they say, "nah, I think they were just friends," but when they give me an absolute argument. ::Sigh::

And post-Hogwarts, I think the only reason I couldn't ever get into that is I have my doubts on Harry surviving book 7! ;) But yeah. I can see where people would like it!

And thanks for the congrats! :)

[yma2.livejournal.com]

Firstly, on the horcux issue, we do see a horcux in book four. Nagini, remember? Now, book one could concievably be Voldemort himself. So... that just leaves book three and seven. The difficulty is we've seen two in HBP, namesly the cup and the ring! So unless one of those will be making a reappearence or has appeared previously, I'm not sure how it fits in... hummm...
It's book three's horcux which is bothering me.
Anyway, I think you're very right about S/R, but I won't let it bother me. I enjoy reading it, so there. I quite like writing it, so I may continue to do that too.
I think you're right about Tonks, but I think there's one other facet here. Tonks has just seen Dumbledore die. Dumbledore; the only one Voldemort was afraid of, the most powerful wizard about. She might be thinking, 'hold on, if he can die... so can ANYONE! and it might not be that she's demanding that REmus says 'I love you,' but just that she has an answer, ANY answer. Because I can picture Remus not being terribly forthcoming with his emotions, either way. (Not least of all because I think Remus is equally terrified. After all, everyone he's ever got close to, who's ever trused him, is dead. That's not really going to do much for his love life.
So though I agree in principle with people's problem with that scene, I don't actuallly mind it all that much. Perhaps because I've been in similar situations.
Though the fact they appeared to be together at the funeral scene did seem a bit... well... I'd have preffered more build up. Meh.
But the interview in and of itself was wonderful, some really good questions answered. I especially liked hearing more about the Marauders and about Snape too. So he was loved, even if he hasn't fallen in love (or doesn't appear to have,) Hummm... and the bits about Slytherin were interesting too. Very cool.

[lls-mutant.livejournal.com]

Ahh! Nagini! You're right! Silly me. But it was three o'clock in the morning ;) And I agree that there could be a little bit left in Voldie. So yeah. Three and seven. I'll have to look more carefully. And heck- it could be completely wrong.

Re: Tonks seeing Dumbledore die. Yeah, you've got a point. I just still didn't like it and never will, but y'know, it's... what? 10 paragraphs of the book at most? I'm not remotely going into denial, but rather putting it into perspective. I'm comfortable enough to finish writing, and frankly, I really hope to be pretty moved on by the time Book 7 comes out! I'm already moving into genfic, not because I don't still love R/S, but because it lends itself better to one-shots, and once I'm done with AiL, I think I'm R/S-ed out writing-wise!

The interview was awesome. I would like to hear a bit more about Lily. I'm a little concerned- and desperately hoping I'm wrong- that James, Snape, and Lupin all had feelings for her. And the reason I'm hoping I'm wrong is that that's just nauseating. Tonks a Mary Sue? No, if that's the case, try Lily's the Mary Sue. But I don't -think- that's what JKR was trying to say, but still.

The bits about Slytherin were interesting, and I'm glad she talked about that. We only see the evil Slytherins (can I just say again how much I appreciated Slughorn????), so getting the word from Her on High that they aren't all Ever-so-evil was good. I really would actually like to know more about Theodore Nott- I have the feeling he might be more interesting than Blaise Zabini. (Am I the only one that thinks of those machines that smooth the ice when I see his name?)

I also LOVED all the talk about Dumbledore. I'd really, really like to know a lot more about him!

[luzdeestrellas.livejournal.com]

I'm very concerned about the effect you're having on my brain today. Because this:

And I keep forgetting that Cuaron was VERY
vocal about how he read Remus. That's not the online fandom- that's someone who works with her directly and has been told not to put certain things in
the film.

And this:

In Part 2 of the interview, she talked about how you could be really attracted to something and then realize it was too much to handle. She
said that and then said "what did you think of Lupin/Tonks?"

are, um, interesting, to say the least.

I will ignore it, however. I absolutely will, because, seriously, I'm learning.

I assume that "those three people" in the context of the interview means James, Remus, and Peter, not James, Lily, and Harry

Yeah, I think so, too. In the context of the quote from Sirius, it makes sense that it's MWP she means.

it
must have broken Sirius's heart to suspect Remus, and did break his heart fully when Peter betrayed them and it led to James's death.

Again, yes. No matter what their relationship was, I think that's true. And now I'm all sniffley for Sirius.

I also think my problem with tonks is along the same lines. Remus has many faults, but lack of strength isn't one of them, and I think that, eventually, the needy Tonks we see in HBP just will stop having any appeal for him. Some of that is coloured by my feelings on where his real interest lies, but a lot of it is just to do with what he's endured, and still endures, and how emotionally immature, in comparison, she seems.

[lls-mutant.livejournal.com]

It's so easy to convince ourselves, isn't it???? But like you, I'm learning too. Best to play it safe and just assume she means straight!Remus going for Tonks. (or bi!Remus.) But I do think maybe she might avoid shooting down the ship. I DON'T think she'll do it on her website (I hope not, anyway!), just because of kiddies, but....

Yeah, that's why Remus/Tonks doesn't work for me. but as long as the ship stays in the background overall, and we DON'T have any multi-colored werewolf cubs, I'll live :)

[ignipes.livejournal.com]

Ships, ships, ships. Is anyone else getting rather sick of the word?

"Ships. woolly things that eat grass and go baa. Easily confused with the other kind." -- A Hat Full of Sky

[yma2.livejournal.com]

I love Dumbledore too, he was always a favorite character of mine and I'll miss not spending hours trying to work out his motivations. Actually, I wouldn't mind if Snape had feelings for her, that would be interesting and explain a bit too. Remus... I quite like the idea on one level, but I don't think it was likely.
BTW, if you've got a moment would you mind checking out the latest entry on my LJ. I've sorta written a mini essay on Sirius and Lupin in the Marauder years, taking an alternate tack from my usual R/S view point and I'd really like to hear your opinion. If you've got time, that is.

[lissannej.livejournal.com]

I don't think anyone can offer absolute arguments, because not every single person thinks the same. The books are open to interpretation and people will see them as they want to see them. I love so many ships that I can see a whole lot of them, but I think your attitude is one we should all share :D

And I can't see Jo killing Harry in book seven. She wouldn't do that to her fans. I sure hope not!

[blackxlupin.livejournal.com]

I don't really have a comment to make on this, since I agree with you on pretty much everything, but I would like to use the opportunity to tell you that I just laughed myself silly rereading your "Accio Bananas" for about the fourth time.

[krisomniac.livejournal.com]

Fish 'n' Ships, anyone??

[krisomniac.livejournal.com]

But the big problem?

It never worked.


Yup. Bingo. And I think part of my rather (for me) violent reaction to those final pages of the book was a basic revulsion to the idea that grovelling will get you a man.

Jo isn't the only one. How many stories does one person lust after someone who just *isn't* right, and in the end, this person finally comes around (Cary/Mr. Big*cough*). Sorry, girls. Life just doesn't work that way, and the faster you realise that, the better off you'll be.

But then again, my refusal to grovel at the feet of any man may just be the reason I'm 24 and completely single with no more than the odd one-nighter in my future...

I dunno. When it comes to relationships, I'm no one to talk, but I do feel that this sort of behaviour just (as you've already said) doesn't work.

--

It's funny. Reading that interview, I realise just how differently I've interpreted these characters from the way that jo intended. I'm more than happy to read the Harry, Hermione, Ron, Dumbly, Hagrid, etc... that she wrote because I honestly don't care that much. I enjoy them but they never captured my imagination.

Remus and Sirius did and in so doing (almost by necessity) they became something for me that the author never intended. Whenever I read her interviews, I'm surprised at the characters as seen through her eyes. They're so different from the ones I got from the text. Either because she wrote such tantalizing and open-ended people OR because I've created my own layers of complexity on top of hers. Or some combination therein. The point is, it shouldn't surprise us. The closer you feel to a character, the farther your vision is from the authorial intent. I think.

[lls-mutant.livejournal.com]

Thanks :) I've yet to figure out WHERE that came from, but I'm glad people enjoy it so!

[lls-mutant.livejournal.com]

Shoot. LJ ate my response.

Yes to everything you said about grovelling.

Hehe. THe woman who lives next door to me is an "average fan"- she's not online or anything, but she reads the books. Needless to say, I don't think she's an R/S shipper. She said she HATED the way R/T was done, and told her 9-year old "never act like Tonks or Lavender once you start dating boys."

And yes to the second part, too. I think we as a fandom have made the marauders more important to the backstory than JKR ever intended. Heck- look at the will. I think ignipes is RIGHT- it's all plot that made Sirius leave everything to Harry. Maybe JKR has an explanation (and I can think of three I'd accept right off the top of my head), but I don't think she expected us to think about it so much. But the marauders... we know just enough about them to be interested, and not enough to block creativity. That was always my problem with ficcing the Trio- 90% of my Trio questions WILL be answered, I'm sure, by the end. But I suspect a LOT of my questions about the marauders will not be.

::Sigh::

[jlarinda.livejournal.com]

Or the mysterious Florence?

You too? You mean the scene from GoF where DD shows Harry his memory of Bertha Jorkins? Cause my friend were arguing with me cause they said Bertha says she'd seen Snape kissing Florence and it never says that. It says "her voice echoed like Snape's" or something like that. And my friend (who's a HUGE fan of Snape) said, even when I showed her the book and proved her wrong, that she swears she's read that. And that all the people she knows in the fandom tlaked about that! O_o it's weird.
If you didn't mean that, well then, just ignore that :P
I loved that bit about Sirius never getting a girlfriend! Cause I see it as "he never got a girlfriend cause he was gayer than christmas and was f*cking Remus all day long".
Of course, someone less biased than me would say he could've slept with every girl in Hogwarts and still not get a girlfriend, but hey, who cares about non-biased people?
Tonks's behaviour is quite like mine. So it's true she's acting childishly. Hm. Makes me a bit worried though. Maybe I should grow up or something.

[blackxlupin.livejournal.com]

I don't think that what makes the story so much is fun is where it came from so much as where it ended up going (down). ^_~

[lls-mutant.livejournal.com]

LOL. I just think Florence is a possiblity, because Snape is totally the kind of guy who would have hexed Bertha Jorkins for following him or talking about it. No other reason ;)

The thing about you acting that way is you're still in high school. It takes a lot of time to work out relationships- and hey, I don't exactly always behave maturely myself! I think a lot of people- at any age- do things or say things in a relationship they regret. But Tonks is an Auror and an adult, and she should have handled a break up or lack of interest with more grace than Ginny- a high schooler- did!

[jlarinda.livejournal.com]

I'll still be in high-school when I'm 21. *is stupid* But I still act childishly all the time. And i don't really care. I never had time to be a little kid, I was too busy learning to be alone. So, I'll act like a five year old all I want. :P Plus is not as if Daniel is the most mature person ever...and he's 10 years older than me.
But you're right, Tonks was just pathetic. I mean, couldn't she choose a better time to beg for Remus's attention? DD has JUST died!
Ah, well, all the better for the WS shippers. :P

[sleeper6.livejournal.com]

Just have to get this in there: that part where you say maybe JKR never put much thought into Sirius, so the whole no-girlfriends thing is a quick insert--she has actually stated before (in Conversations with J.K. Rowling) that she's got whole background stories worked out for her characters. She even specifically mentions Sirius in that she has a "whole childhood worked out for him." So hey, she must have a good reason for him not having a girlfriend/wife. And yes, I also want to think it's because he was in a passionate love affair w/Remus that continued through his death. She's not gonna say this, obviously, but we know, right?

[lls-mutant.livejournal.com]

Yup. We know :)

I don't think she hasn't put ANY thought into Sirius, but I do think she's put less thought into him than some of we MWPP fans have. I've got "whole childhoods" worked out for some of my characters, and it didn't take that long. Also, with Sirius only being 22, I do think the "no girlfriends" thing is nice and easy... (and yeah. he was shagging Remus. Totally :) )