Breathing Again

[lls_mutant]

::breathes deeply.::

Remus/Sirius specifically, and things related to marauders

Oh thank GOD, Remus/Sirius did not come up.

However, I do suspect it's not meant to be canon. When asked about the godmother (again!), JKR mentions that Sirius never had time to get a girlfriend, let alone marry. To me, that sounds like she thinks he's straight. But it's not a from-the-horse's-mouth sinking, so meh.

Before I got too into R/S, I had the impression that JKR really never thought much about them as a couple- or at all- and the subtext was accidental. I mean, really, most everything does have a platonic meaning to it. Actually, I think every bit of text has an alternate platonic meaning to it. However, I do think that it's canonically plausible with what we know right now, and that's good enough for me to be going on with, at least to finish Accidentally In Love. However, I think the ship as a whole would be very, very wise to stop shouting we're canon or should be canon. It's an interesting dynamic, and that's enough.

The reason she can't say much more about the godmother situation, however, I suspect plays into the war. I DON'T think they were suspecting Remus heavily already. Note that in her original answer to this question, she points out that it was JUST Sirius, James, Lily, Harry, and the priest. No Peter. No Dumbledore. So why not no Lupin? My guess is that Peter, Dumbledore, and Lupin agreed to stay away in order not to attract any more attention. Because even though they were in hiding, I don't think the Fidelus charm was on them yet- it sounds like Peter broke that pretty quick.

I AM very appreciative of this sentence:

Right, well, that's what I believed. Sirius would have done it. He, with all his faults and flaws, he has this profound sense of honor, ultimately, and he would rather have died honorably, as he would see it, than live with the dishonor and shame of knowing that he sent those three people to their deaths, those three people that he loved beyond any others, because like Harry he is a displaced person without family.

I assume that "those three people" in the context of the interview means James, Remus, and Peter, not James, Lily, and Harry (although that fits as well). While I firmly believe James and Sirius were "bestest friends", I don't think Remus and Peter were unimportant to him. I think that Remus and Peter were the most important people in the world, and then James was the most important person in the universe, if that makes any sense. It also makes me think it must have broken Sirius's heart to suspect Remus, and did break his heart fully when Peter betrayed them and it led to James's death. God, of all the things I love about Sirius, his devotion to these three is at the top of the list. And that's actually why I think he never really made a commitment to Remus in Accidentally in Love (there's a huge difference between loving someone and a commitment)- he couldn't fully distill what he was feeling. His platonic feelings for Remus were so strong already, that the romantic feelings sort of got lost.

Anyway.

Very little we didn't know about the marauders, although I was delighted to see Lily/Lupin confirmed as a non-romantic thing (at least requited). The reason I was delighted had everything to do with Kloves and nothing at all to do with the shippers, because I've never really heard much of a peep from the shippers and they seem quite normal. But I always thought Remus would never do that to James. Nice to know she was kind of popular, though, and I think the Snape being in love with Lily theory picked up some steam. I was hoping for something a little more complicated, but HBP shot down those expectations. (Which is not bashing HBP. I think what HBP did was pull me back into perspective.)

And Snape was loved? IS that by Lily? Or the mysterious Florence? Or his parents? We have the impression Snape's miserable at home, but really- his father was shouting at his mother. As a lot of children of divorce can tell you, that doesn't mean they didn't love him.

Some random thoughts:

Ron's Patronus being a Jack Russell is too cute. I saw a really nice theory on Patroni on HPfGU that the form of your Patronus is determined in some way by your happiest memory. It's a sweet theory, and I quite like it.

Hmmm. A couple points I've written being proved wrong. The Veil was never used for executions, just study. Oh well. I still think Mentors is one of the best pieces of fanfic I've written, so who cares? And James's and Lily's parents died normal deaths. Y'know, I really considered doing that. I really did. But it was too many normal deaths in too short a space- that's why I wiped them out in what amounted to a terrorist attack. I'm not saying it doesn't work: in JKR's stuff, where the focus is on the present, you can kind of ignore four deaths in a matter of years. In Accidentally in Love, where it's the backstory you're being told, that seems kind of weird- especially when so many people are dying from Death Eater attacks. But one thing I think JKR and I both agreed on: you can't put TOO much angst into those deaths- it just gets overdone and overloaded then. (Especially since they aren't Lupin, King of Angst.)

Can I just say I am SO glad there's nothing else going on with the gum wrappers? The scene with Neville and his parents is SO touching... I just wanted it left entirely alone. No hidden meaning... just a very difficult love. And it is.

I really loved her point about how, in OotP, Cho sees Harry sitting with Luna and Neville and he's embarrassed, and when he's seen with them in HBP, he's proud. I noticed that in the book (and the sad lack of both characters ::sniff::), and it made me very proud of Harry. I also thought it was a very realistic and touching way to show how much Harry has grown up.

I'm glad she cleared up how George and Fred got the bet right at the Quidditch Cup, and I'm happy about her answer, as well. Those two are a riot.

Someone somewhere wondered if we've seen a horcrux in every book so far. Oooh- interesting. Let's see. We do know we saw the diary in book 2, the locket in 5, and Hufflepuff's cup in 6. What could we have seen in 1, 3, and 4? It's definitely a thought.

Aberforth/Goats has more support! Whoohoo! (Joking. Sort of. I do think that's really funny.)



Thoughts on the ship conversations in the interview, and the fallout.

Ships, ships, ships. Is anyone else getting rather sick of the word?

Okay. So, my OTP is Remus/Sirius, and my lesser ships (or favored ships, because I do nothing about them) were Harry/Ginny and Ron/Hermione, Charlie/Tonks, Bill/Fleur, the canon ships, and that's pretty much it. So I realize I have VERY little to complain about in HBP. Sure, Remus/Tonks came up, but that doesn't discount Remus/Sirius (as we've been over 1,324,962 times), and while I LOVE Charlie/Tonks as a fan ship, I never really held out that much hope for it as a canon ship. (Because, y'know, it would require them actually meeting.) But I got Harry/Ginny, Ron/Hermione, and Bill/Fleur, plus some cuteness on Molly/Arthur.

But I will be SOOOOO glad when the shipping frenzy dies down.

Re: Part 2 of the interview, and the repeated use of the word "delusional." First, I've gotta say that was tactless. But tactless, as Ron frequently shows, is not a sin punishable by death. I have issues with Mugglenet at times anyway because of their anti-slash slant, but y'know, the kid running it is EIGHTEEN. And although he kept calling Harry/Hermione shippers delusional, Jo didn't use that word.

Then some of the Harry/Hermione shippers decided to prove him right. Egads.

Being on a ship that I am now saying has no chance of being canon, but at least makes sense, I can sympathize with Harry/Hermione shippers (the rational ones, which I realize is a far bigger base than the psychos), even though I've never shipped the pair. Sometimes we as the reader see and are more interested in a different dynamic than what the author intends for us to be interested in. Heck, that's why fanfiction exists! The trouble with ships like Harry/Hermione, Remus/Sirius, and McGonagall/Dumbledore is that they make sense. They make a lot of sense, and you can see where, but for authorial intent, these people might truly love each other. Some form of love is there in the text, in black and white, for everyone to see. Hermione and Harry DO love each other, as do Remus and Sirius and McGonagall and Dumbledore. And a lot of these shippers believe that love springs from a base of friendship. I've always believed that friendship is an important and necessary component of love, and these are three very strong friendships. Where do you really draw the line between the kind of love they have, and a romantic love? Sometimes it can be very, very hard. So I can see where the Harry/Hermione shippers come from, even if I don't agree.

And I have to admit I was holding my breath as I read a lot of part three, waiting for one of the interviewers to go on about how delusional or whatever we Remus/Sirius shippers are.

But to those ranting and raving and frothing at the mouth, chill. Please. Of course, most of you are not on my f-list, but I need to say it for my own sanity. CHILL. There's a huge difference between wishing your ship had happened and going psycho.

It's FINE to not like a ship. JKR is not perfect, and we don't have to say she is! But please do not start letter-writing campaigns saying that one ship or another should have happened. JKR is not out to destroy fans' lives or slight Hermione or degay Remus. I don't think she's the most brilliant romance writer ever (<-- glaring understatement), but I do think she's had these ships planned. I don't appreciate the emphasis on romantic love at the end of this book (the kids don't bug me, but the adults pairing off did to an extent), but it's not that offensive- just annoying, cloying, and trite. If you're really unhappy with how the ships turned out, think about what you like about YOUR ship, and use it in original fiction. Make YOUR story come out the way you want it to. And with that in mind:

I solemnly swear that when two guys appear to be in love in my fantasy series, that will actually be the case. And it will so be intended.

Anyway, while I think this Emerson person was truly tactless, it's time to move on with life.



Thoughts about Remus and his love life.

Okay. Just this last bit before I finally crash for the night.

I do accept Tonks/Remus as canon, if you couldn't tell. I've been thinking about it a lot, here and there. And I've put my finger on exactly what bugs me.

It's partly Tonks going all lovelorn, yes. But as krislaughs and others have pointed out, Tonks is very young. And she also has her place in the ranks of the blunt and tactless. But you know what makes me so uncomfortable about that hospital scene? I've behaved like that.

Yes, I can remember (although I don't care to) breaking down and crying because a crush or an ex wasn't interested. I was a little younger than Tonks, but even when I was Tonks's age... I can remember some nasty fights with my husband around the 1-year-into-the-relationship mark, although they weren't as bad. I look at myself now, and I look at myself then, and I don't really recognize myself. I've grown up. A lot. So part of Tonks's behavior is a squirm factor: partly because it's pathetic and partly because I've done similar. But the big problem?

It never worked.

Pity is not a basis for a relationship, and that's about what that reaction generates, usually. Pity and annoyance. At least, that's been my experience. It doesn't convince the guy you're right. That's NEVER happened to me. Now, granted, I don't exactly have a huge base to select from, but still.

So yeah. Anyway, I got thinking even more about how Tonks doesn't really understand Remus, because she wouldn't bring it up and yadayadayada and then I thought... Liss, you ship Remus and Sirius, of all people. Why do you think this is relevant?

Ouch. Good point.

Cause let's face it- which is worse, in the long run? Crying and begging right after Dumbledore dies and in front of people, or siccing you on an enemy as a prank and later suspecting you of being a spy? It's not like Remus has the best track record (in my head) of chosing people that are good for him, does he? Now, granted, the issues with Sirius are far more complicated, or can be, if you chose to make them so. But still.

Anyway, I'm tired, so I'll finish this off and say good night. And I think (I hope) this is the last you're going to hear from me on the subject of Remus and Tonks (because I'm really sick of the subject). Considering I don't write much post-Azkaban fic, much less post-OotP, I don't really expect it to be a big deal.

Comments

[lissannej.livejournal.com]

The trouble with ships like Harry/Hermione, Remus/Sirius, and McGonagall/Dumbledore is that they make sense. They make a lot of sense, and you can see where, but for authorial intent, these people might truly love each other. Some form of love is there in the text, in black and white, for everyone to see. Hermione and Harry DO love each other, as do Remus and Sirius and McGonagall and Dumbledore. And a lot of these shippers believe that love springs from a base of friendship. I've always believed that friendship is an important and necessary component of love, and these are three very strong friendships. Where do you really draw the line between the kind of love they have, and a romantic love? Sometimes it can be very, very hard. So I can see where the Harry/Hermione shippers come from, even if I don't agree.

Thank you SO much for saying this, Liss. I wholeheartedly agree with you -- friends can and do love each other, and strong friendships like that between Harry and Hermione can lead to more. Even though it won't in canon, it doesn't mean the potential isn't there. Hence why I ship H/H post-Hogwarts *g*

And congrats on the baby boy!

[lls-mutant.livejournal.com]

You're welcome :) I couldn't agree more with the friends thing- hubby and I were friends for a whole year before we got together, and most of my friends married their good friends as well. It's not like the hate/love ships, or the cross-gen ships. And like I said in my post, most H/Hr shippers are not insane ;) Every ship has their few bad apples!

I sometimes think what causes ship wars is the one side's refusal to admit the other side might have a point. I've seen a lot of people saying that most H/Hr fans never expected it to become canon, but this is why they love Harry/Hermione. And I think the arguments start when people say "but Harry and Hermione will never get together because it's going to be Hermione and Ron!" rather than "Hhmm. Interesting point, and I can see why you like that. Don't agree- I like Ron/Hermione better- but yeah. It's not impossible." I know that's when I get really annoyed at people who are anti-R/S. Not when they say, "nah, I think they were just friends," but when they give me an absolute argument. ::Sigh::

And post-Hogwarts, I think the only reason I couldn't ever get into that is I have my doubts on Harry surviving book 7! ;) But yeah. I can see where people would like it!

And thanks for the congrats! :)

[lissannej.livejournal.com]

I don't think anyone can offer absolute arguments, because not every single person thinks the same. The books are open to interpretation and people will see them as they want to see them. I love so many ships that I can see a whole lot of them, but I think your attitude is one we should all share :D

And I can't see Jo killing Harry in book seven. She wouldn't do that to her fans. I sure hope not!