Not Creme de Minthe

[lls_mutant]

Question for you all:



For my purposes, I've decided it's probably eau de Dementor. (To mimic Nanny Ogg, that's foreign for Dementor piss.) I think it's a pretty good guess- it's at least reasonable.

Here's the question: when Dumbledore drank it, did he relive his worst memories, or was it his worst fears? Or was it a combination of both?

If it is eau de Dementor, it makes sense that it would be Dumbledore's worst memories. (And for Tom Riddle, a worst memory would probably be something like cuddling a kitten, so he's probably immune to it, if his worst memories don't bother him.) But the way I read the text made me think that Dumbledore was envisioning a time he couldn't protect his students. (But was it his students? One of the themes I touched on when Caradoc found out that Dumbledore wanted Remus to be a spy was that it's an old man's war and a young man's fight. It could be that Dumbledore felt a lot of Bad Feelings for watching the younger members of the Order die as he survived. Or it could be something else entirely. Perhaps Grindewald threatened the school. Perhaps it was his younger siblings, and he wad defending them against his parents or attackers or whatever.

Anyway, I'm curious to see what people think, if there's an overwhelming consensus one way or the other. I usually don't let other people drive what I write, but since this is an unconsequential decision, I'm curious to see what people think.

Comments

[a-t-rain.livejournal.com]

Well, another popular theory in fanfic seems to be that he's reliving somebody else's worst moments, e.g., Regulus's, or Dennis Bishop and Amy Benson's.

Personally, I haven't the foggiest; to me it sounds more like liquid Cruciatus than liquid dementor, but either way probably works.

[lls-mutant.livejournal.com]

Hmmm. I don't like the popular theory there. Not for what I'm doing.

Yeah, I agree there's some major physical pain going on there as well, but it also seems like there's some psychological stuff too. Physical pain's easy to justify or figure out. It's the psych stuff I'm confused on.

[kyasuriin.livejournal.com]

I think I read in a fanfic somewhere that DD lost all his family in the first war and somehow it became canon to me, so I imagined that he was reliving the loss of his family and being unable to protect them.

eau de Dementor is a good idea, you're so clever :)

[poolman.livejournal.com]

I don't think that could ever be canon... doesn't his brother bartend in Hogsmeade?

[kyasuriin.livejournal.com]

I meant his wife & kids, not siblings, parents, etc. Yeah, Aberforth does bartend in Hogsmeade, but I think Albus would feel more responsibility to protect his wife and children rather than his brother/sisters/parents/etc.

[lls-mutant.livejournal.com]

I like that idea, actually (even if Aberforth is still alive). And JKR hints that DD has a really interesting past.

And thanks :)

[kyasuriin.livejournal.com]

yeah, I was actually thinking more along the lines of his wife and children, the people who he might feel more inclined to be super protective of. I'd really love to read more DD gen fic. I'm sure he does have a great past. JKR hinted that his scar shaped like the subway map was going to come back so maybe we'll learn more about him in book 7. wish I had a DD icon.. :( (& why do we use 'DD' as the short form, not AD?)

[tesseract-5.livejournal.com]

I have this foggy notion that it's "living death", the potion mentioned in the first Slughorn Potions class in which all the attention was quickly diverted to Felix Felicious and Amortentia.

But would it be THAT painful, and then we get back to the "DD's not really dead" theory which I find to be bunk.

[a-t-rain.livejournal.com]

Isn't the Draught of Living Death described as a powerful sleeping potion in PS/SS, though? Whatever Dumbledore may be in this scene, he's pretty clearly not asleep.

[lls-mutant.livejournal.com]

Yeah, I don't think it would be that painful. And even if that's what it was, DD still took a tumble off the Astronomy Tower after being AKed. It was like JKR said "this time, I'll make SURE fandom knows he's dead!"

[tesseract-5.livejournal.com]

lol, way too logical,

yeah yeah, I totally agree with you there, just can't help wondering ;)

[topaz7.livejournal.com]

I was thinking "worst fears". My son thinks Dumbly sees his students being attacked, which sounded about right to me.

[lls-mutant.livejournal.com]

That was actually one of my big theories, too. If DD was younger, I'd be all for this. But when you have 150 years under your belt, you may have seen your students attacked before, y'know? :) But I think this is incredibly likely. I think I'm going to go with a mix.

[kanella.livejournal.com]

I don't think it's as much his worst fears as it is events in the *past* over which he feels guilty. It must be hard for Dumbledore to look into the faces of men like Remus and Sirius, who have been beaten and broken by the war(s) against Voldemort. Dumbledore knows what needs to be done to defeat Voldemort, but he must feel awful for all of the young idealists that marched happily to their deaths for the cause (and for the children like Neville and Harry that are left behind to suffer). With every new death or disappearance, Dumbledore, as the leader of the Order, had to have felt feel some measure of responsibility, and I think that the "It's all my fault...I know I did wrong...not that, I'll do anything" really speaks to that - feelings he can't express around his followers because he is supposed to be the strong and composed leader.

[poolman.livejournal.com]

I did get the impression he was reliving something, but I also got the impression of distinct physical pain as well.

What *I* always want to know is why wouldn't you just fill the cup and then CHUCK IT? :)

[lls-mutant.livejournal.com]

Yeah- I got the physical pain, too. Which is really easy to put in- just make eau de Dementor toxic.

And yeah, I've wondered that too! I know one popular theory about Regulus is that he dragged Kreacher along and made Kreacher drink the potion. But why not chuck it? (I guess intent matters, or something like that.) Or get one of the zombies to come out and drink it.

[cryingyofaceout.livejournal.com]

The real mystery is right after that, with the whole Augamenti thing? Why didn't Harry carry the Auguamenti in his hands or (I don't know how strong the Augamenti is...) just directly into Dumbedore's mouth? Why is Plan B Zombie Water? No excuse, except for Harry being super panicky something something.

I assumed the stuff was crazy potion. It makes you crazy. I didn't read too much into it, so "crazy potion" doesn't fit as nicely as it should. It annoyed me how Dumbledore just kept on drinking though, so I guess he was at least somewhat sane, and not totally lost in any sort of memory. Unless the memory involves drinking.